When I shop at the farmer's market on Saturdays, I'm appalled that the Embarcadero is allowed to remain open to cars when the market is open. There are vendors very close to the street, and the exhaust from the cars certainly leaves residues on the produce. Not to mention the hassle of crossing the street against all of the traffic.

We need to move toward removing all private motor vehicles in cities and replacing them with public transit powered by local wind generators and solar collectors. Driving is one of the most environmentally destructive things average people do, and there's no excuse for having cars in cities, where one can easily get along by public transit, walking, and biking.

Tom said, "There are many things that you cannot do without a car in the city." Well, there are many things you cannot do without cyanide or a nuclear bomb, but that doesn't mean you should have them. I grew up without a car, and guess what: we were a family, so having a family is no excuse for destroying the planet by driving (not that anything is). Cars didn't even exist in large numbers until about 60-70 years ago. And only about 8% of the people in the world drive cars. So this idea that a car is a necessity is a big lie. You can organize your life so that it's difficult or impossible to live without a car, but that's your choice. No one HAS to drive.

They put a outdoor market next to a road and the visionaries want to close the road? Also it seems the visionaries can't figure out crosswalks.

I also find it odd, visionaries can't decide which food to buy on their own, they put a outdoor market next to a road and the visionary thinks that they have to buy the food next the road.

Oddly I would guess that the people who own stalls prefer the stalls next to the road, and the confusing cross walk.

I think that Jeff is pointing out that cars are an American luxury, one that -- unlike TVs and phones and even airplanes -- has a particularly destructive impact on the environment. I have a car, Tom; I use it to get my kids to school in the morning (there really isn't a viable public transport alternative right now; in a couple years, when they're a little older, they'll both ride Muni). But too often, we just use our cars because it's second nature; we're used to driving around. I've actually found it's LESS convenient to use my car for much of my travel in the city. When I ride my bike to work, or to City Hall, or to downtown events/bars/restaurants I find that I get around much more quickly and easily. Traffic and parking aren't the same hassles. And it's a lot more fun. Frankly, I hate driving. I can't wait to reach the point when my kids are old enough that I don't need the damn car at all anymore.

We don't have to ban or abolish cars. If people who didn't need to drive -- who do it just because they haven't stopped to consider the alternatives -- didn't drive, there'd be a lot less traffic on the streets. That would make Muni faster -- and yes, make it easier for those with disabilities and those who have special needs to get around in their cars. It would also eliminate tons of greenhouse gases, oil imports etc.

Most people who live in Manhattan don't have cars; they don't even think about it. If we had just a little more of that attitude, it would go a long way.

Tom,

You don't need cars or any other machines or modern technology to have fun. The most fun I've ever had was doing things like sailing, which humans have been doing for thousands of years and which does not require consuming oil or polluting the air and water. You can have fun just hanging out with friends, playing on the beach or in a park, seeing live music or a movie. If you have to destroy the Earth to have fun, there's something wrong with you. And more importantly, it's highly immoral that it's OK to do environmentally harmful things just to have fun. What about someone who thinks having fun is shooting up a neighborhood?

Glen's comment is a perfect example of what's wrong with the "individual liberty" crowd: they don't give a damn about others or the environment. Their philosophy is that people -- usually themselves -- should be allowed to do whatever they want, regardless of the harms it causes to other people or the environment. When anyone tries to regulate or stop that destructive behavior, they cry about curtailing their freedom, saying that we're trying to tell them how to live their lives. Well, guess what: if you don't exhibit maturity and responsibility, you NEED to be told how to live, just like a child. And anyone who would harm others or destroy the environment is not exhibiting maturity or responsibility.

You can probably get by in the 'Cities' without a car but anywhere else, in California and most western states cars became a necessity. The American dream was a business plan. The white picket fence, the lawn and garden with the Chevy/Ford and that sense of freedom was media hype at its height for the baby boomer generation, by engineering giants who developed massive highway systems (instead of a integrated transit system) especially out west to sell us gas and tax the hell out of us. Ever since Saudi Arabia became allied with certain engineering giants, years of profits would stream from foreign oil as it is much more privatized and more profitable (domestic oil from our own land would be more socialized, not such a bad thing.) Not to mention the government contracts to build our massive highway system.

Now it's not about freedeom, now it's about fun as Tom has been programmed by the new media pitch.

Before the inception of cars in the east and midwest metro areas were thriving. I grew up in the Bay Area, but lived in New York and Chicago for about a year and the transit and highway system are far more accessible and efficient out there. Those metro areas thrived before 'this business plan' and so weren't designed around it. I've also visited other countries where most people cannot afford cars and they're public transportation has sprouted out by need.

It's a different story out west, I'm sorry to discover. There is nothing wrong with dreaming but we must be responsible adults. Demand clean energy. With demand supply will follow.

You ever wonder why gas prices are the highest out here in the bay area? A higher demand maybe?